A Voice for the Voiceless…


Date: July 11, 2018

01) Why pro-contact pedophile arguments are bullshit (by a pedophile)

“Pedophiles (or MAPs) can be moral human beings who never hurt a child, despite their attraction. Don’t be suckered by those who say it’s OK to act on it or those that claim it’s inevitable you will.”

I haven’t yet fully read this virtue signaling mess, that appears trying to throw other MAPs under the bus…

…To be honest…I don’t feel like it…and I know, if I start…it could be an “all night project”, just responding to these points…I have other things on my mind…

I can say one thing, though…Bly Summer and company should be fully ashamed, for starting out with a title like “Why pro-contact pedophile arguments are bullshit”…

…One hell of a lot of contempt, worn on their sleeves there…Very cocky…a sort of “shot over the bow”, if you will…and when they don’t even have the resources and knowledge, to back themselves up…

Enter A Voice for the Voiceless…Likely the only person involved in any way with that post [in the comments section], who is even worth reading…And I must say…Voice is remarkably worth reading…

I knew this sort of thing was eventually going to happen…particularly with the cocky VP members, who strut around doing this sort of thing…generally spewing venom at the rest of us who don’t hold their “pious” positions, and misrepresenting us…

…At some point, someone who actually knows their shit “down to a T”, was going to stroll into their “virtue parade”…and outright embarrass them…mop the floor with them, with hard facts…actual studies…and a working knowledge of them…

…And the cocky bunch don’t even know what to do…On some level…it’s sad…on another level…it’s hysterical…

…This is an embarrassment, they sorely deserve, for such a stunt…I’m glad I got to see it…

I’ve been extremely charitable, and supportive of VP:

…Over the past few years, I’ve tried to be supportive and have a good faith, healthy relationship with the VP members on Twitter…There are a lot of them, and you cant really avoid them…

I initially saw them as something “fresh and new”…maybe not perfect…but a hell of a lot more energetic and motivated to fight “pedophile” stereotypes, than I was at their ages…

Maybe I should have stayed out of it…or at least asked if I was welcome…but, I really liked the idea behind their #talkwithpedophiles hash tag…and I intermingled with it, during it’s early days…being more reserved, because I didn’t want to step on anybody’s toes…I understood…I was in “their house”…

I released in #talkwithpedophiles, one of my most personal and hard offerings, ever…which was no small thing…

…I wasn’t trying to steal anybody’s thunder…I just thought it was a powerful something, to help spark life into the project…give real life issues, to discuss…It got only a couple of tweets in response…It got ignored by virtually everybody…

…Which says a lot…I think, mostly about the sociopaths who visited that hash tag…that something like this would be entirely sidestepped by them…in preference for quick bashings and death threats…Virtually nobody arrived at that hash tag, for substantive dialogue…

At any rate…I’ve been happy to give them a bit of extra exposure and traffic…so long as they weren’t getting too rowdy, with their poo pooing of other MAPs…so long as they were reasonably playing nice…

…It’s disappointing, to see where they’ve decided to take things…to say the least…

Pro-Contact:

I don’t call myself “pro-contact”…and this is intentional…

I’m not entirely sure where the pro/anti-contact dichotomy came from…though it’s been around for many years…

…I’m not even aware of “pro-contact” having an established, agreed upon definition…

…What I do know, is that it emphasizes “contact”, in a way as to make it seem…that “contact” is a leading, or primary, motive…Very much like how anti-abortionists call pro-choice people, “pro-abortion”…without their input or agreement…It’s a way to pigeonhole…maybe even poison the well…but it’s boxing somebody else [an adversary] into something, that maybe isn’t entirely honest to be boxing them into…

If you want me to pick a position…I will readily admit, that my views are of a pro-human, pro-dignity, pro-respect, pro-tenderness, pro-loving, pro-freedom, pro-rights, pro-education…pro-choice…

I am confident, this would land me into what some call “pro-contact”…

…But “contact” of that nature, is not my goal…I am no drooling pervert, with a single mind on sex, and how to get it…

To me, and my definitions of life and ethics…”Sex” is a sliver of the mixture…It’s just naturally there, where the rest of the relationship is working…It’s not something you can base everything else off of…and if the relationship is failing…then so is your chances at sex…

…If you don’t put in the work, and treat your perspective companion right…then there will be no sex…

…There is nothing dirty, about beautiful sex.

Relationships must be fully represented in their total accuracy…including their sex…Socially inconvenient things [by some people’s opinions], must not be censored…

We must make value judgements, and practical judgements…based upon real representations of relationships, in society…not based upon stereotypes, and old wives tales about “curses of the sexual touch”…

If my defense of these principles are offensive to anybody…then so be it…

…But, this is where I stand…

…I tell society [most especially the fanatics], to stop impeding research…and let the chips fall where they may…We can discuss things, when we have a clearer picture…But allow the picture, to be attained.

Above all I am pro-honesty, and pro-decency…And what we have emerging so far, looks favorably upon people who hold my open minded stance…I know that much, because I’ve paid attention to the research, over the last two decades…Which is why I am pro-choice, in the spirit of my broader stance.

I cannot even tell you:

I find it hard to put into words…what it has meant to me on a personal level…having the ability to journey down this path of self discovery, over the past twenty years…This is a pilgrimage, which every MAP should experience…

…As MAPs…we don’t even comprehend, all that we don’t know about ourselves and the world around us…until we experience this trek…

…It is honestly important, in understanding who we are…and our natural place in this world…

…It is disheartening, to say the least…watching young MAPs act as parrots and lap dogs, to the very system…which is going to tare them apart…

It is disheartening…watching them embrace the lies…and believing as though they are in the morally superior place…

…One day…when they’ve had enough time to build a personal history to look back upon…I hope they will have wised up…and that they will have learned the value, of listening to wise, knowledgeable MAPs…the value of respecting MAPs, who’ve known and navigated this treacherous world…the value of having these MAPs as allies, to draw upon…the value of building and maintaining bridges, with people who should have been sought out by them…

“Pride cometh before the fall”…

This face of VP…is damn prideful…

…It’s just sad.

They don’t want to be part of the movement seeking truth?…

…Then they’re not part of a real movement, at all.

Thank you:

…to A Voice for the Voiceless…

You are an uncommonly good human being…

…I just wish the pursuit of accuracy, and the necessity behind it, weren’t lost on so many people of this era.

I also wish so many others hadn’t forgotten, how to allow other humans to be human…nor about the necessity in it…

…We live in a world that’s obsessed with timelines, calendar dates, social roles and strictly followed “life” scripts…

…Somehow…our cultures forgot how to make a life worth living…

…In my personal theory…the modern mass violence…shootings, and domestic terrorism…I cannot believe, that there is not some kind of link, to our subjugation in this anti-human culture.

13 thoughts on “A Voice for the Voiceless…

  1. Omnipolitx

    “Why pro contact pedophile arguments are bullshit.”

    I see the cocky VP fucktards at it again with their smug and generic performance, basically being a beta to all the ones that abuse them. HA! Not unusual these tragic mistaken cumstains seem to have that moral compass up their ass still and the one thing they pull out of that ass of their’s besides the dicks that have been inserted into their assholes by the notorious omega male foundation designed to bury their assholes and people who hate their kind for many years is pure cockiness with a side of little to poorly made arguments! Gtfo VP with your morally righteous horse shit and go relieve yourselves to somebody.

    Reply
    1. eqfoundation Post author

      Certainly…stunts like that don’t help, in trying to heal the rift between our groups.

      I don’t know what they imagine they are accomplishing.

      Educated people can disagree, and still be respectful about it…

      …There’s no reason for people to be dick-ish about it, like they chose to be.

      Reply
  2. feinmann0

    I like the following quote attributed to Kinsey seventy years ago: “The history of medicine proves that in so far as man seeks to know himself and face his whole nature, he has become free from bewildered fear, despondent shame, or arrant hypocrisy. As long as sex is dealt with in the current confusion of ignorance and sophistication, denial and indulgence, suppression and stimulation, punishment and exploitation, secrecy and display, it will be associated with a duplicity and indecency that lead neither to intellectual honesty nor human dignity.

    I think it is instructive to view the contra-contact stance, irrespective of who voices it, in the light of what Kinsey is saying so loud and so clear. Unfortunately, ignorance and self-aggrandisement inevitably obscures the truth every time; thus humanity (if you can call it that) shoots itself in the foot over and over.

    Incidentally Steve, I envy you your stamina to have entertained Christ-like support for VP in the way you have done. I could never do that. Re pro-contact and its flexible definition … it is evident that VP and their kin use it as a weapon to bludgeon the rest of us. In doing this, they assist the sexual abuse industry in constructing a monstrous barrier between adults and children.

    Reply
    1. eqfoundation Post author

      That is a great quote, yes.

      “Incidentally Steve, I envy you your stamina to have entertained Christ-like support for VP in the way you have done. I could never do that."

      Yeah… 🙂

      …It’s been an interesting three years, or so…However long it’s been…

      I do feel they have been useful on social network platforms, in boosting MAP presence, in such a way…as to make it harder for services to discriminate against us…

      I also believe, that broadening what I share from other MAPs, kind of softens some of my own, more sharp tongued and even “darker” content…like some of what I was writing, when I first started blogging…

      …but, ultimately…they are a type of assimilationist organization…

      Of all the people on this chessboard…people like you and I, have always been the pragmatists…Heck…in a world of forced extremes…we are the moderates…as I see it…

      …At the very least…we are balanced, respectful and honest.

      Reply
    1. eqfoundation Post author

      You know…I saw Todd Nickerson retweet it…claiming it was “the best article he’d seen yet, debunking pro-contact arguments”…I followed the link…I wasn’t really going to spend a lot of time sifting through it…But I thought I might read it, and make a few comments here…Voice already did way more [and better], than I ever would have…So, I just figured I’d point him out…

      You don’t have to do much more than look at the title…For me it was like…”This is how you intentionally choose to come out of the gate?”…It was remarkably crappy, the way they set the tone of this piece…

      I didn’t see it …but, allegedly Voice got irritated, emotional, or whatever, in an early response…and one of the people behind this “article” was calling him out over it…

      …I was setting there thinking…you half dozen intentionally decided to demean other MAPs…and you’re shocked that those MAPs might respond in a less than appreciative manner?

      It’s kind of a hoot, watching one of them trying to keep up with Voice…when he’s clearly way out of his own depths…Yet, he’s oblivious as to just how badly he’s being trounced, and exposed for…a fool…someone lacking integrity…

      And TNF 13 was also behind this…showing up to flex a bit of his own demeaning “authority” in the comments…as if he were ever in the league of Voice…

      …There’s quite the story that could be shared about that bozo…

      …A MAP with a [physical contact, I believe] criminal past, trying to redeem himself by being the system’s lap dog…who couldn’t figure out why so many of us were up in arms, after his campaign encouraging everyone to report anyone “expressing pro-contact” [“pro-pedophile”] views, to the FBI…

      People like that aren’t just the most pathetic players on the chessboard…They’re outright dangerous…and display a grotesque contempt, for two of the fundamental rules amongst MAPs, which keeps our existence in this world stable…

      …We do not interfere, with each others ability to express ourselves…

      …And we sure as fuck, do not throw each other to the FBI, or any other LEO agency of wolves…

      These are unforgivable sins, in the MAP community…and it would take an Olympic level dimwit, not to be able to figure out why.

      As a matter of human decency…we don’t throw each other under the bus, either.

      Forgive my swearing…but when people cross these lines…they’re nothing but a self serving rogue…and I have nothing good to say about them…vulgar words, are about all I find fitting, when discussing people like that.

      Reply
  3. Contact Lens

    My take on “pro-contact” is that kinds and pro-kind people must take this sledgehammer away from the antis, by becoming it. After all, contact is the reason any of this (even drawings of imaginary kids) is an issue. So, contact is where the debate must be won.

    It would be one thing if contact were even harmful in some way, but there just no evidence of that. The harm comes from things we agree are harmful (e.g. violence), from outside judgment, and ironically from the longing for MORE contact.

    Not only harmless, sexual contact is also beneficial to individuals. And even if were merely neutral, or even had some cost, the possibility of sexual contact attracts relationships that have a number of other benefits to the individual as well.

    I have no problem adopting the “pro-contact” position, and label.

    Reply
    1. eqfoundation Post author

      “I have no problem adopting the “pro-contact” position, and label.”

      Believe me…I take no offense, over pro-contact positions…and I’ll say again, my positions are very open minded towards contact…

      …I just don’t like others trying to make the sex “the” fundamental focal point, when there is so much more going on against sex positive people, which we care about combating.

      I am pro-contact, if one means humans having the freedom of free association…But I’m so much more, than this one issue.

      I agree, with defending a “pro-contact” stance, as well.

      Reply
  4. Voice

    A close friend of mine actually did me the favor of linking me this post, and I would like to say that I really appreciate that you wrote this and that someone got something out of those comments that almost made me tear my hair out to write in response to such idiocy. Sadly, though I don’t think they’ll find any sort of embarassment in their disingenious arguing, they all do it so well that they’re probably not even aware of it. It may come across as arrogant to say, but I don’t think they’re even mentally capable of having that kind of conversation honestly. All of those time consuming and painstaking exchanges have made me question whether there’s enough benefit to talk with people who work to twist words and maliciously misattribute beliefs to you or if it’s better to search for groups more interested in having actual conversations.

    With all that having been said, I do think people like TNF, BLY, and Julian are beneficial to the goals of the “pro-contacts” as well. It seems to me that the destigmatization of the attraction and the person holding it will lead to the ability to research more taboo topics in regards to child sexuality and pedophilia than we’re allowed to now. It’ll also lead to better understanding of us as humans. The virped acceptance of us may start out as the openness to get treatment and to be able to exist out in the open, but social progress doesn’t just stop at the point that the founders of the social movement say it should. Once it’s not a danger to be out and the voices of MAPs can be publicly heard, it’ll be made apparent that the desires of most of us aren’t rape, coercion, or anything remotely harmful to the children we love.

    I’ve thought about the term pro-contact and have somewhat foolishly became comfortable with it, even if alternatives much better express the problems I see with how children are treated. The one I probably like the most even though it would inevitably cause problems would probably be pro-consent because that’s the thing I see as being the most important thing when it comes to both sexual and non-sexual matters. Adults are so quick to deny a child’s ability to consent in sexual circumstances and imply an importance to it while completely denying it or any need for it in contexts that aren’t sexual. It’s a nice word but I probably wouldn’t use it due to the constant need to clarify though. Another term that’s been tossed around solely for it’s ability to piss other people off is the one pro-evidence, and I’ll just leave it here in hopes to get at least a smile. I really like the way you put it though, I’d wholeheartedly agree and accept all of those values.

    I think a big problem with being pro-contact isn’t really the term itself and in a lot of cases isn’t tunnel vision on a child’s sexual rights, but it’s more about how the most controversial beliefs people argue for are the ones that other people remember. I could argue that the education system is terrible, that children should be treated differently by adults than they currently are, and that it’s immoral to keep information from children and I’d get some percent of people that would agree with me on those points. I think that to talk about sexual freedoms is to be remembered, and loathed, for nothing but arguing against age of consent, or, with more buzzwords, advocating for “child abuse” and “molestation”.

    I’m really glad that you found value in the things I said, and I’d like to thank you in return for taking the time to write this and make me aware that someone found value in what I said. The reason I put time and energy into such things is in hopes that the people who read my exchanges are open minded and can see the flaws with the arguments of the opposition and any sort of dishonest arguing they find themselves doing. It’s a bit demoralizing sometimes when the majority of conversations you get in follow the exact same pathways as that article, so reading this makes me feel a bit sane again. There’s a lot of other things I’ve thought about touching on and some I may when they’ve better organized but this is probably long enough for now.

    Reply
    1. eqfoundation Post author

      Thank you, for saying “thank you”! 😉

      “Pro-Evidence” is wonderful, yes!

      I have a strong appreciation, for people who walk into situations like that, and stand up they way you did…It can certainly be hard to do that…It complicates things even more, when other MAPs are the adversaries…

      After my father died…I went through about a year there…where I just kind of had a lot of “something” to work through…and get out of my system…Part of that involved live exchanges on Twitter, with anywhere from one to four people all at once…Often, the people were incredibly abusive…but you always had to think on your feet…

      I know what it’s like, carrying on “day long” exchanges, with hostile people…

      It’s a rare talent, being able to maintain some degree of structure…and offer something worthwhile, that onlookers can take away from it all.

      As an aside…your comment went into my spam folder…I sent it to the main folder, and approved it…But, now I cant find it any place, where the “Like” option is available…Strange…

      Reply
      1. Voice

        The main reason I argue with people about things like this is to either prove I’m right or be proven wrong. When you end up talking to people who don’t have arguments or that aren’t interested in entertaining other perspectives it’s an ego boost at first and allows you a few laughs, but when everyone you talk to is so uninterested then you begin to lose hope.

        The exchanges on that article was especially bad and I’m still bouncing back from them. The people I had exchanges with are the prominent anti-contact pedophiles, ones with influence and ones I’m not enemies with under a different name, so I had a baseline level of expectations that were very far from actually being met by the conversations.

        I think that my main problem with it all was how quick they were to attribute beliefs to me that I didn’t have or that were even the opposite of what I had actually said, and with such surety that they must’ve known my own mind and position better than I did. It’d have been far less frustrating if it had been more civil and if the focus wasn’t just on trying to make me look bad. That being said, I think it’s fair to say that the article wasn’t meant to create that kind of environment or really do anything other than pander to people who already agree that pro-contacts are wrong or dishonest in their arguments.

        The main reason to debate with people like that is in hopes that onlooker get something out of it. The people confident enough to make an article about it or to argue so fiercely (and badly) are people that can’t be convinced. I think of arguing with people like Julian or TNF in a way similar to that of arguing with a religious person and that’s what allows me to do it. I’ll never convince them but someone else might find what I say or how dishonestly they argue convincing.

        I don’t use wordpress at all (as you can tell) so I can’t help you there :p. It actually took me a few minutes to realize that you probably had to approve my comment before it showed up.

      2. eqfoundation Post author

        “It actually took me a few minutes to realize that you probably had to approve my comment before it showed up.”

        Sadly…I have to keep my comments on pre-approval…I’d rather have them completely open…by my days of being entirely anonymous online, are long in the past…

        In addition…other MAPs have been and get outed…and you never know when you might come here, and find someone trying to post their information.

        It’s a sad world we live in…and I’m not giving the opportunists an opening.

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