What We Don’t Know About Europe’s Muslim Kids and Why We Should Care [Deeyah Khan]…


Date: August 15, 2016

01) What We Don’t Know About Europe’s Muslim Kids and Why We Should Care [Deeyah Khan]

“Aged 17, Deeyah fled from Norway confused, lost and torn between cultures. Unlike some young Muslims she picked up a camera instead of a gun. She now uses her camera (and her superpower) to shed light on the clash of cultures between Muslim parents who prioritise honour and their children’s desire for freedom. She argues that we need to understand what is happening to fight the pull to extremism.”


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A Few Complicated Thoughts on “Virtuous Pedophiles”…

Date: August 15, 2016

Virtuous Pedophiles official website

I’ve never been a member of Virtuous Pedophiles [VP], and make no claim on internal knowledge of the group. I know what I know, from years of watching it’s self representing members.

…I’ve also witnessed a lot of VP clashing, with us more traditional Minor Attracted People [MAPs] who’ve been presenting a public face to the world.

Whether any of what follows is 100% accurate, 100% false…or it more realistically falls somewhere between the extreme margins…these are genuine points of conflict [and sincere perception], based on our historical legacies.

a) VP is largely looked upon as an assimilationist movement…

…And many MAPs who’ve spent their lives in hiding, being abused by their culture and the system…who’s life transforming experience, was learning the truth about themselves and their culture…and learning how to seize their own voice…

…many of those MAPs are accepting none of it…

…Because to accept, re-internalize and propagate the message and practice of an abusive culture [even if only in part]…is walking backwards…It’s worse than losing ground…It’s re-affirming what is worst, about these conflicts…and helping those destructive things to thrive.

This is sacrilege to many MAPs.

For a lot of us who’ve withstood many storms and assaults, and who’ve stood the test of time…It seems like we are finally reaching an era, where “normal” people are figuring out that we are not going away…and largely, they’ve given up on trying to run us off.

This is progress…It’s an early benchmark…I am pleased to see it.

Paradoxically…VP, with it’s closer to mainstream message, might be helping to ease this transition.

b) Who is represented in VP leadership?…

As a more less classic pedophile [one who is strictly attracted to prepubescent humans], who has no true legal options, sexually…I would not even think of belonging to a “pedophile group”, where someone like myself was not at least on a steering committee…

…And given that the founders, and so many of the most vocal members, have at least a dual sexual orientation involving entirely legal [and non-stigmatized] options…this creates a very real problem…because there is no way possible, that this kind of structure can honestly comprehend and represent, a life and existence like my own.

I’ve been coming to think of VP more in the sense of, “I’m happy with my wife, and normal life…Oh, but I also incidentally pop boners for boys and girls…But that’s okay, because I’ve never needed them in that way…I’ve got my wife, see?”…

That’s all fine and wonderful, for some…There have always been “pedophiles” of that nature, around and involved…But is that really a fair representation, that so many of the rest of us MAPs can identify with?…or that we want representing us?

…It’s entirely alien, to me.

Sadly…from my vantage point, VP has looked to be made up of essentially three kinds of “pedophiles”…One is the group I just mentioned…The second is old and burned out MAPs, who just don’t want to fight anymore, and VP represents something they believe “hasn’t been tried yet”…And third, the young and idealistic MAPs…who haven’t had to walk this path for several decades, learning harshly how the system really works…oblivious to the knowledge, that the system is built upon the premise, of a right to shred people like us to a bloody pulp.

I’m positive anyone could nit pick at what I’ve just expressed [IE: they have their own outlook and status, which is not represented above]…But if you can understand why I’ve pointed out these things, and understand the honesty behind my words…then you should be able to figure out, why these points are so relevant.

Addendum: I left out one additional sort of MAP…The “penitent pervert, enthusiastic convert”…or the “last refuge of the scoundrel” syndrome…

…These rather un-charming chaps got themselves into some legal trouble, and now they’re back with a vengeance, to redeem themselves…by enthusiastically targeting other MAPs, and making themselves a nuisance.

How better to earn brownie points with your parole officer, than to go online as a newborn moral crusader, preaching and enforcing the common sermons?…and showing off everything you’ve been up to, whenever you are forced to visit? The witch becomes the witch hunter…

…and mentally elevates themselves, by deciding that now even they have someone else to look down upon and attack…

…I find these sorts of MAPs to possibly be the single most distasteful and irritating characters, on the entire stage of this social conflict.

c) Stop using NAMBLA as the dog you kick!

This has been a disturbing behavior amongst some VP members…bad mouthing and running down previously existing MAP organizations, because they never promoted the VP platform.

…Some VP members imagine themselves doing something noble, by openly condemning NAMBLA [and similar organizations], or otherwise acting to sully it’s character.

There is no justification or defense for this behavior, period…and it is the sign, of an ignorant mind.

It would be far better for them to simply not acknowledge NAMBLA at all…or to show a bit more class, and just say something like, “Different MAPs have different life experiences, leading to different outlooks…We respectfully disagree with theirs”…

NAMBLA has fought some incredibly important battles on behalf of all MAPs, whether they like it or not. NAMBLA has forged the path, on which so many of us MAPs even have a voice at all, today.

How about a little bit of compassion and human decency here?

If you are an opinionated MAP, standing up for MAP rights…you already owe a debt of gratitude, to organizations like NAMBLA…whether you like it or not.

I am amongst the many MAPs, who owe this debt of gratitude…and I find it absolutely sickening, to watch other MAPs throwing groups like NAMBLA under the bus…

…You sorts remind me of gays and lesbians, who will disavow anything the second it becomes politically inconvenient [no matter what it’s done for them, or how far it advanced them], just to jump ship and cling to anything they believe will advance them further…An utter lack of principled integrity.

The open honesty and integrity of NAMBLA, has always been of a better quality than that of VP.

Just because so many people don’t like honesty with integrity, and prefer the re-affirmation of existing social paradigms, does nothing to change that fact.

People who would burn down the very legacy, which built the place they stand upon…they have no future…they have no loyalty…they are not leaders…They are easily led slaves.

This is one aspect about VP members, I find most offensive…

…There are many, many good and decent MAPs, who are of the NAMBLA viewpoint…I am amongst them, incase there was any doubt…

…We don’t deserve being slapped in the face, or spat upon, by you…or called “crazy”, or any of the other below the belt rubbish, some of you do.

Some of you at VP wonder why there is so much backlash against you, from other MAPs?…This kind of arrogant contempt, is amongst the valid reasons. It only serves to create bad will and turbulence, amongst MAPs.

Snap Judgment #720 – Genetic Sexual Attraction…

Date: August 13, 2016

01) Snap #720 – Nuclear Family [MP3]

“One mom, one dad, 2.5 kids and a white picket fence? This week on Snap Judgment we get real. From WNYC Studios, Snap proudly presents…”Nuclear Family.”

Genetic Sexual Attraction [GSA]…

This segment starts at 26:50.

I’ve heard of this sort of thing before…when relatives who are estranged [or maybe never met] finally meet…and they end up having sex with each other.

Sometimes it turns into long term relationships…and there have been a few high profile examples over the years, involving celebrities [IE: Mackenzie Phillips].

While I do wonder if GSA is a real thing…it’s hard to deny the relative commonality of consensual incest. Is there something there which some of us pick up on, that others don’t?…Something that makes a close blood relative, especially appealing?…Or do we somehow lack an inborn nature, which would make close relatives unappealing under all circumstances?

I’ve believed for years…that the natural inclination of humans when offered sex, is to willingly have sex…and that when we choose not to, it’s because of other mitigating circumstances. Yet even if turned down…many will have still wanted the sex…and will possibly masturbate to the fantasy later, in private.

I think…sex is every bit as alluring with a blood relative, as it is with a non-relative…and that no biological barrier is in place, to ward off it’s temptation.

Whatever barriers exist [or don’t], are cultural…as well as a matter of interpersonal relationships…

…For example…if marrying your first cousin is common place in society, then nobody is going to think anything odd of it…

…And as to interpersonal relationships…if a family member is especially mean towards you, you are probably not going to want to play around with them sexually, or be comfortable having any form of sex with them.

Of course…there are always exceptions.

CIVILIZATION VI – E3 2016 Walkthrough…


Date: August 12, 2016

01) CIVILIZATION VI – E3 2016 Walkthrough

02) Civilization VI YouTube Channel

“Watch the behind-closed-doors theater presentation of Civilization VI at E3 2016. Narrated by Sean Bean.”

I guess it releases on October 21, 2016…

After the horrible misstep of Civ 5, I just don’t know about this one.

I purchased everything Civ 5, except the Beyond Earth [or whatever it is called] expansion…I just kept holding out, wanting to like Civ 5…After a few hours of Beyond Earth, I completely washed my hands of everything Civ 5…and dreaded imagining, that I may be done with the series, if “this” is their idea of a good, new direction.

It felt like they were trying to drag the series more into the realm of real time strategy…and I hated it.

All the stuff that sounded interesting about Civ 5 [like city states], I felt was just lame in implementation…and proved to be more a nuisance, than anything else.

Interesting ideas were in Civ 5…they may be salvageable concepts…but they just were not fun…and they really dragged the game down so much, that I simply did not want to play it.

I was so desperate to find something about Civ 5 that I would love…that I kept buying…but the game was just a turd…only made moderately more interesting by it’s expansion.

…So, I am overjoyed to learn that they are scrapping Civ 5, and rebuilding from the ground up.

Still…they’re going to have to go a few extra miles, and prove themselves to me again…before they get any money out of me for Civ 6.

A few “wish list” things, however…

…I’ve always wished that they would visually simplify who the allies are…and things like who shares a defense pact…It’s always annoyed the hell out of me, that you can’t tell at a glance who all you’ll end up at war with, should you declare war on another civilization.

Another thing…since we are talking about a new incarnation of the game…If we are forced to get vital resources from trading with other civs [city states, etc.]…I want it more obvious when some other civ starts demanding that I cancel all trade deals with another civ, whether I’ll be cutting off a vital resource to myself.

I’m sure I could come up with more to say…

…Bottom line…I’m not rushing out to buy this one.


No “strict liability” for soliciting minor online for sex, if minor claimed she was above the age of consent…

Date: August 10, 2016

01) No “strict liability” for soliciting minor online for sex, if minor claimed she was above the age of consent

“Say you are trying to pick someone up online for sex. You’ve never met in person, but she tells you in your online conversation that she’s above the age of consent (16 in most states, 17 in some others, 18 in still others). Let’s say that you have no reason to think she’s lying, but she is: It turns out that she’s underage. You never meet and you never have sex. Can you still be prosecuted for soliciting a minor for sex, on a “strict liability” theory — i.e., that you were trying to pick up someone who turns out to be underage, even though you didn’t know this or have reason to know it?

No, says today’s Minnesota Court of Appeals decision in State v. Moser, holding that a state strict liability solicitation statute was unconstitutional.

The child-solicitation statute makes it a felony punishable by up to three years in prison for “[a] person 18 years of age or older” to solicit “a child [defined as someone under age 16] or someone the person reasonably believes is a child to engage in sexual conduct with intent to engage in sexual conduct.” Solicitation may occur “in person, by telephone, by letter, or by computerized or other electronic means” (emphasis added)…. The statute clearly states that “[m]istake as to age is not a defense to a prosecution under this section.”

This underscores one of the worst problems in law, and law enforcement…the people behind it commonly don’t care, and live their lives as though they don’t have to care…

This is what happens when law and law enforcement become dogmatic ideology.

…They remove any allowance for legitimate human error…They just want their arrest and conviction stats high…and to remove people who like the wrong kind of tail from society.

Law enforcement in the USA is literally a “by hook, or by crook” venture.

GirlChat: A bit of historical perspective…

Date: August 09, 2016

01) Merge with GC?

Free Spirits did give rise to Girl Chat, yes…And as I recall it, when they were surveying the general attitude of BC BLs over it, there was an overwhelmingly accepting tone [so long as they maintained responsibility of their own board].

I don’t know what has brought on this era of vitriol…But there once was a day, when some of us were proud of Free Spirits, for having given GLs a place.

While I’ve never honestly had any deep level of power or control, here…I have considered myself amongst the people, who helped GLs get their own board.

I’ve always been supportive of this [as well as general BL / GL empowerment], since my earliest days on BoyChat…That may come as news to a few people…but it certainly should not, as I’ve never changed my stance.

…It is part of our legacy, to help GLs…despite our differences, and despite whomever around here is trying to break that alliance.

Yes…to respond to something I meant to mention…I know about Common Ground…Why wouldn’t I?…I participated in the discussion prior to it’s formation…and I am all but positive, that it’s namesake was taken from a comment in one of my posts.

Things have changed a lot since then…BLs and GLs have been intermingling for years, including at dreaded places online like twitter…And we don’t have all of this manby pamby drama and tantrum throwing, like has been witnessed in this thread.

Any decent person learns how to rise above their differences, and see the humanity in others.

…Get a grip, people…

…An individual has arrived and made a suggestion…The sky is not falling, in a blazing flame…Someone has simply given us a starting point, for a discussion […oh, the horrors]. Anyone can shape the discussion, bringing it around to something more palatable…

…Some of the ways a few BLs have decided to respond in this thread, have just been embarrassing…entirely uncalled for…and the foundation of bad will.

We all know that short of some kind of LEO take down, BoyChat is not dissolving [and likely not GirlChat, either]…I don’t know what any of you find so personally threatening here…

…But your chosen responses have exposed way more about yourselves, than anything else.

A Piece of History: Phillip Greaves II…


Date: August 08, 2016

I’m hesitant to share this first video, because I’m unclear of the nature and integrity of the channel behind it…and with it originally coming from a channel and series named “REICH WATCH Aryan Empires”, which appears obsessed with “truther” level “exposes” on Adam Lanza…I strongly wanted to leave this one out…But it has an actual copy of the Anderson Cooper episode in it, which is relevant to this case. Last time I was searching for that content, this video was the only thing I could find.

01) The Amazon pedophile handbook

02) CNN: ‘Pedophile guide’ author speaks

03) ‘Pedophile’s Guide’ Author Defends Book

04) Pedophile Book Author Interview – NF5 Raw Video

05) Author of pedophile book arrested in Polk County

06) Pedophilia author busted on Polk warrant

07) ‘Pedophile’s Guide’ Author Arrested

08) Interview With The Author Of Pedo Guide [another copy of the NF5 Raw Video]

Guy’s rant about social hypocrisy (there are additional relevant news bits):

09) Pedophile Guide’ Author Confident E-Book Will Be Back on Amazon

The base facts:

In 2010 [2009?], Phillip Greaves II published a book titled “The Pedophile’s Guide to Love and Pleasure”. He listed it on Amazon.com. He sold a few copies of it, including one to a cop in Florida…who was purchasing it, explicitly to be able to evoke a vague, Florida obscenity law. Charges were filed, as was a warrant for arrest…and Philip’s home state arrested and extradited him to Florida. Phillip acted as if he was going to fight this case, but he did not.

A simultaneous campaign working to force Amazon.com to purge “pedophile books” latched onto this, and quickly leveraged it into an act of brazen censorship…what some of us refer to today, as the Amazon.com Book Burnings.

This was an attack on MAP expression, the likes of which we had never seen in the modern era…And because of our lack of organization and resources…it was a disaster…and a complete injustice.

Yes…This all happened in the United States of America…a territory which fraudulently calls itself “the land of the free”.

A few comments:

a) Sheriff Grady Judd represents everything that is most wrong with law enforcement, today. He pursued a man, and abused his own position of power, in order to attain an underhanded [and ethically indefensible] outcome he wanted…all because he was morally outraged, at the thoughts and opinions of another human being.

Grady Judd is exactly the type of human being I am talking about, when I employ the term Moral Supremacist. These are people who work to destroy other human beings, on the grounds that they philosophically disagree with them.

We have way too many Grady Judds in positions of social power…and these people are the real predators of society.

b) This is the most stark and shocking attack on the free speech [and expression] of Minor Attracted People [MAP’s], in recent history.

It was exactly the type of case which demanded being fought…Yet despite Phillip’s initial talk, he very quickly relented, and took a plea deal…and handed these people some easy, “case law” precedence.

c) We need greater organization and unity as MAP’s, in order to fight this exact type of brazen abuse.

I have no idea why the ACLU was not all over this [like they should have been]…but that fact that Phillip was left stranded, alone in this situation…that says probably the single most damning thing about the larger MAP community.

d) Most of us MAP’s were blindsided by this…We did not even know anything about this book, which was only listed for sale a matter of days…and sold very few copies.

This incident did hurt us, however…in that many relevant books [including empirical research], were delisted from Amazon.com…when some group [which had been trying to get “pedophile books” banned from Amazon.com, for years] seized on this abnormal set of circumstances, and leveraged it into forcing Amazon.com to “ban” an entire list of books they did not want listed.

They effectively made certain books [some rather important], harder to find…harder to get a copy of.

e) I’m sure Phillip never imagined things would transpire, as they did…and he did not expect his simple, open expression to become the center of such an important battle. I’m sure he was acting in good faith, with an honest conscience.

…I still would have never advised anybody, at all, to bring cross state commerce into something like this…because it opens up too many additional angles of attack. If he wanted to express these things to people…he should have just done it on a website for free, out in the open…with disclaimers…and probably anonymously.

f) I have a hard time speaking ill of Phillip, or of his book…which I have never read…

…But I will say this…

…The nature of his book, “A Pedophiles Guide to Love and Pleasure”, is not something which most of the books getting black listed deserved being judged by.

Most [if not all] of the books, were not of that nature. They were not “how too” manuals…

…They simply explored pedophilia either as a research subject, or as a social issue.

Why they all got taken out, based upon Phillip’s book…is the big scandalous question.

g) Amazon.com needs to do the ethical thing, and restore these book listings.


M.A. Voice: Issue 12 – August 03, 2016…


Articles and content from Minor Attracted People [MAPs], presented in no particular order and without preference or discrimination. These are diverse viewpoints.

Date: August 03, 2016

01) kabouter: the long arm of the Hysteria

02) Hummingbird: Poem: A Boy on the Bus

03) leonard sisyphus mann: Francis Kilvert & His Diaries – part 2

04) Tom O’Carroll: Acceptable danger: the sky is the limit?

05) Filip30: Important study about child-adult-sex from Finland [important thread]

06) Ender Wiggin: Pedophilia As A Sexual Orientation

If you’re a Minor Attracted Person [MAP] who would like your content featured in the next issue, please use the form below to pass along the necessary information.

You may also submit content created by other MAPs. Any form of legal content [written, audio, video, artistic, academic, personal expression, etc.] will be considered for inclusion.

All submissions made via this form are private.


Other Issues

The Ark Encounter: A Less than Grand Opening…


Date: August 03, 2016

01) The Ark Encounter: A Less than Grand Opening

“Ken Ham’s “Ark Encounter” has been hyped – by some – as a tour de force of biblical truth, adventure, and potential tourism dollars. It officially opened on July 7th.

Our four (atheist) panel guests were there for the occasion: David Silverman, Tracey Moody, Dan Broadbent and Aron Ra. They give us the report from the field.”

Ignorance and Incredulity at the Ark Park

Atheist_Media_SB_ArchiveAtheist Media Links